Partial transcript of audio tape: December 1992 (probably 26 December) at Howard And Stephanie DeVoe's townhouse in Rockville, Maryland

Transcribed 15 February 2004 by Howard DeVoe. The audio quality of the first portion is poor.

K = Frank Kenneth DeVoe
H = Howard DeVoe
M = Martha (Josselyn) DeVoe

H: Would this be a good time to... I want to ask you again about the story associated with this photograph... the one that Margaret Troupe sent me a copy of the one that Gladys Strickler sent her. Is this Grandma Troup?

K: Yes.

H: Who's to her.. who's at the left?

K: Her son.

H: Is that Charles Junior?

K: Yes. And this is his wife.

H: Oh! Alright, that's Capiola... in front of the tree there.

K: Capitola.

H: And coming down beyond her, ... Elsie.

K: Elsie. And that's Millicent.

H: (Surprised) That's Millicent in front?

K: I think so. ..."Me" there

H: Well "Me" would have been Gladys. I think Gladys wrote on this.

K: Oh. Oh, I see...

H: This came from Gladys originally. Well, who's the boy off to your right?

K: Everett. Everett DeVoe. He was the oldest... This is Uncle Herbert.. that's his wife. This is one of four children. And this is, that's probably Leslie DeVoe... (unclear)

H: Way off in the distance?

K: No, that's Uncle Fred.

H: At the far end of the table.

K: My father's twin brother, and my father are certainly not in the picture. (Chuckles)

H: Well, what.. where was this taken?

K: In the Anderson place, the place we lived in for a number of years as caretakers. And it was a big sixteen-year-old house and a barn... this was a picnic area there in the woods, and the house was over here... Finally the estate was settled and the whole property was sold. There's almost an arboretum too, there are trees in there, a lot of those were sold off ...the group of barns was over here and orchards were up here... orchards are still there.

H: Barns in the left and orchards at the back, and - now coming around to the left of the photo from Uncle Fred, your mother must be one of these.

K: Here, right here. ...Mrs. Lawrence

H: She would be to the left of your mother.

K: To the right.

H: Well, I mean to the left in the picture.

K: Oh, yes.

H: And then, who's that?

K: Those two people there, I don't know.

H: And then we come back to Grandma Troup.

K: That's right.

H: Okay. Well, that's...

K: This was sort of a fourth of July picnic...

H: Margaret Troupe asked me to make, send her copies of these photos. I've taken black and white pictures but I haven't developed them yet. Um, Mary Troup, 18 years old.

K: Is there a date on it?

H: Yes, it's written on the back.

K: Mary Troup. (Pause) Well, that must have been the one that died in 1914. And she was a secretary in New York City, and lived (?back of) a two-family house, and my father and mother ... on one floor and then my grandmother and (pause) (?I'm wondering whether) Aunt Rae, Aunt Mary rented the second floor - no, it was the third floor... For a while there was a three-family affair. She had something that she died of - something that's well-known today... I remember going to... coming back from the ceremony... we sat on the front porch in summertime; it was a pretty warm day...

H: I'll move this closer. (The audio quality improves after this.) I have her dates from the cemetery records... This is your grandmother...

K: No, that's Mary Walpole. ...My Uncle Walpole was a farmer up near (unclear).

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(Discussing the photo showing Harry Mayne, W. H. Cargon Jr, Harriet (Aunt Hattie) Cargon, W. H. Cargon Sr., and William Walpole)

K: I don't know where - now where was this picture taken?

H: Could that have been taken at the farm?

K: No, I don't think so. I think that's the house that's still standing, that the Cargons lived in - Aunt Hattie Cargon and Uncle Will.

H: And where was that?

K: In Katonah. We're a ways out of the center of town.

H: So that must have been why everyone went to Katonah.

K: This is, that house was at the foot of the hill where the big house was that Harry Mayne bought after a bit - he didn't own it - he bought that about the time that - well - when I was pretty young, because I remember that we went picnics - holiday picnics, and also for the Christmas sometimes, Thanksgiving always, and I would go visiting Marion; my family would bring me up to Katonah, I'd stay with Marion, and Grandmother would be with her sister.

H: So the Cargons were the earliest people in Katonah?

K: Doubt it. ..probably early..

H: This is

K: Aunt Rae.

H: Rae. She is beautiful in that picture. What is that house - any idea? Seems to be having a picnic outside a big white house.

K: Hmm. Those picnics were often held north of Katonah. Maybe not far from Katonah. They were around the reservoir frequently.

H: This is

K: Aunt Mary.

H: That's right, Aunt Mary. Mary Mayne, it's written on here. A beautiful picture.

K: She was a very stately person.

H: Well, she certainly was when she was old, I remember.

(Going over the photo of the family group at 36 Davis Avenue: the person standing between the unknown man hiding behind a sunflower, and Harry Mayne, is Mr. Krom or Krum, a friend of Aunt Rae's. The man behind the sunflower could be Kenneth's father.)

H: This worries me. I found this - this is a list of people in another photograph, but I don't have the photograph. (F. K. DeVoe pointed out that the list was for the people in the picnic at the Anderson place.) So I just got that one. Well then how, how do we happen to have a list of the people in this, and yet I just got this photograph from Margaret just this month, and haven't had it before? Did you send a photograph from Marion to Gladys, by any chance? I mean, after Marion died?

M: You did send something to Gladys, didn't you, Kenneth? You had it around for quite a while and didn't get it to her.

H: Then that's what happened.

M: You remember? It was in your desk for a long time and you said "I must get this off to Gladys."

H: And here's the list of people. Well, isn't that interesting.

M: Well I just, just suddenly dawned on me, last Christmas he had something around, and he didn't send it until...

---

H: Well, the mystery is solved. I didn't know what this list referred to; now I know it referred to what Margaret Troupe just sent me from England, because Gladys had sent it to her. It's gone full circle! (Laughs) ...You see, Margaret has written on the back here "Sent to me by Gladys Stickler October '92, original returned to her November '92. It says here "a 4th of July family picnic at the Anderson House on Post Road White Plains," which is probably what you wrote to Gladys and told her.

K: Umm.

M: I though the picture he sent to Gladys only had two or three people in it.

K: Oh, well they were wedding pictures.

M: Okay, then it wasn't this picture.

H: Nevertheless, this picture, I didn't have a copy of it, unless I lost one, but somehow it's back again now. ...I've shown you everything in here, I guess, that's of interest. Well, thank you for clearing that up.

K: We didn't bring that album, did we?

M: You told me not to, because that wasn't the person we were looking for.

K: Oh. These were just boyhood pictures of mine.

M: It's a looseleaf album, so I could take them out and send them to you if you'd like it.

H: Really, what Margaret is interested in is the Charles Troup who came to this country.

M: The one that Nancy has.

H: Yes. I'll talk to Nancy about it. ...Well, thank you. That's cleared up a lot of things. I didn't recognize that this picture here was the same one that I had a list for. So now it's back again. If I had it, I think that I didn't have it long enough - you sent it off to - I think you must have sent it to Gladys.